Zohra: 0:02

Hello friends and welcome to season eight of Inside Tech Comm with Zohra Mutabanna. This season features a collection of conversations that explore the ideas, challenges, and opportunities shaping technical communication today. From AI and content strategy to leadership, product thinking, and the future of our profession. Each episode offers a fresh perspective from people doing the work. Let's get started. Season eight is proudly sponsored by LavaCon. Use discount code ITC26 to save $200 on registration for this year's conference. I'll share more about LavaCon later in this episode. Hello listeners. Welcome to a new episode. Today we have Ramesh Aiyyangar, and we are going to be talking about how with the field, the way it is evolving currently and where things are with not just because of AI and new technologies, but because the roles and career paths and expectations in the community are that the practitioners, the technical writers that support, is shifting. So we'll explore what these changes mean for the community and draw on Ramesh's experience across industry, leadership, training, mentoring, and community building. This is going to be more of a human conversation. With that, Ramesh, welcome to my show.

Ramesh: 1:25

Thank you so much, Zohra, for giving me this opportunity to be on your show. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. And I must add, Zohra, that you're doing a great service to the technical communication profession by doing these podcasts and getting specialists and others to share their insights. And we learn a lot from these podcasts and there are a lot of takeaways. So I really appreciate that you spare your valuable time to talk to experts, and it's a huge learning for all of us from the tech comm community. Thank you.

Zohra: 2:01

Thank you, Ramesh. Thank you. It's a pleasure doing this, and it's thank you to people like you who are willing to come and talk to me. So it's a community effort, and I appreciate that. Appreciate your time as well. Ramesh, introduce yourself and tell us about the different roles you've played in your long career.

Ramesh: 2:19

Absolutely, Zohra. So to tell you very briefly, I enjoy simplifying the complex, enriching it, and that's what I've been doing. And I know it's been a long journey, nearly four decades so far. So the way it happens for me is I would divide into two phases. The first phase is before tech comm and after I joined tech comm. The reason why I would like to do that is the common thread is communication. So before I entered tech writing, I'm primarily a journalist and I worked as a reporter, editor, and I also had short stints in terms of advertising and public relations and other areas of communication, which tend to be more on the creative side, or as we call as a MarCom in today's parlance. And around early 90s is when we got computers and we started acquiring computer skills, software knowledge, and so on. And that's precisely around that time, around 93-94, I entered the software industry. And my first job as a tech writer was with a software company in Pune called Kale Consultants, and it was more of ISO documentation. And of course, I had no clue about technical writing then, and it's been a totally hands-on approach. I don't have any formal degrees in tech writing. Thanks to my peers in US and Europe and other areas who helped me acquire the primary core skills and, of course, the community. I owe a lot of my skills, my accomplishments to the STC community, where I've spent a substantial time of my professional career is around two decades, and I enjoyed every moment of it, not only in terms of learning and development, but also the community aspect in terms of networking, connect, and so on. And I'm very thankful to STC for having given me this opportunity to be associated so closely with some of the best in the industry. And of course, a lot of them whom I work very closely are pretty seniors right now. In fact, I would like to call out a lot of names, but I would avoid that, who had a major influence and who have helped me through. But it's been a really satisfying and long journey. But at the same time, it brings a lot of disappointment to me. The news that STC, uh, had to close its operations a few years back. And of course, I feel uh that you know we still do not have a global community like STC, which really enabled a lot of things. In fact, they were critical in terms of defining our profession, creating awareness, promoting things, and listing everything that we really needed, especially for folks like me who were in India and didn't have a clue about it. It helped me a lot. And of course, I wanted to do my little bit. And since I had this experience with STC, I started my own group in India called as Institute for Technical Communicators of India, which is primarily a free platform to enable people to come together, connect, and learn. And eventually this platform kind of you know uh translated into what I see right now as a company, which is TechWritePro. Of course, I do not have any major commercial ambition, but my mission is primarily to create awareness and promote the profession in whatever limited way I can, and to empower technical writers uh to a great extent and provide opportunities, enable them, recognize them, and do whatever I can as an individual through this company. That's roughly my background.

Zohra: 6:24

So that is a very impressive background. Four decades, congratulations on that, Ramesh. Thank you for doing that. I think we need more such anchors today than we realize.

Ramesh: 6:36

Thank you so much, Zohra, for your kind words.

Zohra: 6:39

You've seen technical communication with such a long spanning career. You've seen technical communication evolve through significant changes. When you look at the profession today, what concerns you most? Not in terms of the technology, but about the people.

Ramesh: 6:53

Absolutely. And you're absolutely right. I mean, especially in this long journey, I have seen tech comm really evolve. In fact, I would extend it further to publishing as such, you know. Uh way back when I started my journalism and was working with newspapers and periodicals. I uh have literally seen the manual uh printing press where they used to assemble those fonts and then kind of print it to uh AI agents today and all about skills. So uh it's like really an evolutionary thing that I've really seen. But the most distinctive and important thing is the human element is always there, and I don't think so, irrespective of the technology changes and other things, the human aspect will go away, especially in terms of tech writing, because it's a very niche skill. Even if it is AI, it's all about documentation, it's all about automation, and it's only going to be about the mechanical or repetitive or iterative task. A lot of things related to documentation cannot be automated, so the human element will always be there. And the most critical aspect, I think, is the critical thinking or the thinking aspect, which is something very specific to humans, and I don't think so. Automation or agents can really do that because even with AI, I think the foundational stuff or the overarching content, or you know, the judgment aspect, the discernment, even after the drafts are created, is primarily with humans. So who's driving all of this? It's the human in the loop, right? So I think that's a very, very important element, and it will not go away. And the core skills of thinking, articulating, explaining, simplifying, giving better examples, understanding the user needs is so important that we understand the psychological aspect, the behaviors, and so on. And we do say that we have agents, the traffic to doc sites are more of agents and stuff like that, but we still do not know how they consume content, right? And it's so important to understand how end users, and definitely it's going to be a human at the end of the chain who is kind of looking at the content. So these things are very important, and I think we really need to uh understand these aspects, especially in the current era of AI, while we talk a lot about automation. I hope that answers your question.

Zohra: 9:43

It does. I think you're right about the human element, the core human characteristics that we have, that we possess, that cannot ever be well, can be replicated by a machine. I'm gonna take a chance and say that. And technical writing is a niche field. And do you have any concerns since you run an institute? What kind of concerns are you seeing surface when you talk to technical writers?

Ramesh: 10:12

I don't see uh quite a few issues when it comes to learning, upskilling. There are a lot of anxiety and there are a lot of worry, and people still are not clear as to what is the path because it's like seeking the unknown. Uh, people are not sure about what careers they will have or what are the things that they need to do, because not all companies are investing in AI. They are not very clear as to what skills they need to build. A lot of it also has to do with self-reflection, because very few individuals really spend a substantial time in understanding or maybe introspecting, realizing their own strengths, weaknesses, or even for that matter, what they really want to do going ahead. In some cases, people take an approach of let's take it as it comes, right? So the kind of clarity is not there. So, what really happens in a situation like this when we are going through a mini-revolution right now, and we are trying to tread unknown territories or explore new areas or new frontiers, how do you really go about it, right? So I think the first thing is optimism. I mean, we have to have a lot of optimism because it's not something that is very easily available or it's there around the corner. It's within you. You have to keep that hope each day. It is something that you build every day, right? So being very hopeful, that's very important because anxiety, worry, stress is not going to help you in any way. It kind of paralyzes or things become stagnant, and then you're not able to act. And that's the worst thing that you can do to your career when you're just kind of you know thinking and not acting. So optimism is one thing definitely. But the second thing is um it's not only about technical skills. People are so obsessed with only the technical skills or maybe just the tools or you know, software and stuff. While it is good to learn these skills, it is good to learn about AI and tools and so on. But as I said sometime back, automation is only to a limited extent. The kind of value that you add is going to be from your core skills, because at the end of the day, it is the experience for the user or the consumer of content, and there's a human at the end of the chain. So that's very important. So while technology skills are important, you also need to focus on the other aspects which are less uh known right now, because we really need to understand the user behavior, how they are really kind of you know consuming the content right now, because it's just not about agents, uh right. So, do we really have data about that? It's not about just some analytics, uh, like how many hits are there on the pages, or how many agents are visiting the page, or so on, but you really need to see the behavior, like what typically we had UX folks doing it, right? The user behavior, trying to see how people are using it because even the customers you uh will be kind of exploring all of this, they will be implementing software, they'll be investing their time in this. So, doc is just a small aspect of it. So we have to understand that, and I think it is still pretty gray, or people do not have enough access to all that data, to all that analytics, or to all those interactions and so on, because not all tech writers are really cleared for that, and that is the area where you can really add value. So, what I would say is the ultimate goal of documentation is to exceed customer expectations. So, irrespective of the technology and the advancement, while it is good to learn all of that, we should not miss the core aspect in terms of why you're writing those docs, for whom you're writing those docs, and how the experience is. It's like uh I can give a simple analogy, right? Like cooking, right? We can have all the ingredients in place, very uh neatly placed, the right quantity, the right volume, and so on. But ultimately, uh the person who's cooking it. I mean, you need to get that taste, right? And taste is something which is an experience. Not everybody can create the right dish with the right taste, something which can be relished. Now that comes with your skills, that comes with your experience, that comes with the knowledge of people who are going to have that dish, and so on. So that's where the differentiator will happen, right? So we have to focus on the taste aspect. You may have the best ingredient, you may have the best chunks of content, but if you don't know how to orchestrate the whole thing, what's the point? I might have the best violinist, I might have the best vocalist, I might have the best guitarist, but if I don't know how to compose or how to create that symphony, that music is not going to be so soothing for me, right? So, or enjoyable, correct? So somewhere we miss that aspect or that overarching the vision, the foresight, the ownership, because doc is not about deliverables anymore, right? It's about uh a service, it's a product by itself. So, do all tech writers really understand that doc is a product by itself? We need to take ownership, we need to have that vision, and that's where other aspects like content strategy is very important, and then we have content design, then we have the other aspect of system design, all right? And then we have the delivery aspect where all the operational aspects are concerned. So these are four major things which are very important as we go ahead. Now, you might polarize to some aspects or you may have proximity to some of these things, but you cannot restrict yourself, you cannot say I do not know the other things, or I will not do this, or I will not do that. You'll have to be extremely flexible, right? And that's where you have to keep moving. If you say no, I am a DITA expert, or I just want to do information architecture, but I don't know about the product, doc as a product. I don't understand content strategy, or I really don't understand the engineering aspect or the engineering depth or the product in detail. You cannot afford to say those things going forward because a lot of things will matter on the value add. Now it's the same product, but there is novelty in there because you have to look at it at different angles, not the same way that, for example, typically in the olden days, when you used to work with products, we always used to focus our time on finding bugs, be it UI, be it the functionality, be it the error, it could be anything. But the way we would look at the product is the effort would be to break it down, you know, and try to do as many things to add value to it from various aspects. So the depth from an engineering perspective is very important. You have to be able to look at a product in depth, not the same way as others, possibly different ways of how users will look at it, or even from your own experience and skills and apply it to some of the things that I mentioned, that is what is going to be the differentiator. Of course, we have other aspects like delivery and all of that, the system aspect and so on. But this is how uh I look at it, or this is what I think will be important going forward. Yeah, I hope that makes sense.

Zohra: 18:31

I mean, you can ask me. Definitely makes sense. How is this message landing with the youngsters that are entering the field versus somebody who's been in the field for somebody who's experienced? Because I'm I'm just thinking right now, the message in general that I'm hearing around me is youngsters that are finding it hard to break into any profession. So, this conversation, as much as it is about technical communication, other roles are equally being challenged. Have you noticed any marked difference in how the two generations, the different generations receive your message that you've talked about from your experience specifically?

Ramesh: 19:10

Yeah, definitely. Because uh, see, in terms of experience, we have to understand there's a lot of unlearning also required because when it comes to learning, unlearning is equally important because when you're going through a revolution, you cannot afford to learn the traditional way, right? Now I cannot learn AI through books or through uh Udemy or doing some certification or you know other things. That's not really going to take me very far. But I can do that, or it can help me understand some conceptual stuff. You have to do things for yourself to get a good grasp of it. Like as I tell them, it's not about formatting your resume anymore, it's not about how good your resume looks, but like as Fabrizio Ferri Benedetti has said in one of his articles, it's about the beauty of the doc itself, right? And when I say beauty of the doc, it has a different connotation or an interpretation, which indirectly reflects on the principles of what good tech writing is all about, right? I mean, for example, if I'm trying to simplify something complex, it should be so simple for the user that he doesn't have to carry the load of the complexity. That is where your value add is. The transformation is the value add, right? And so the difference between the youngsters and the experienced is how you really adapt, how flexible you are. And definitely we all know that with age, with experience, we try to erect walls, we try to create fences, we try to get deeper into something, and you know, you don't want to experiment or you know, try out new stuff and all of that. I would definitely not recommend something like that. But the younger folks, they're totally new, they are open, they don't have any such blocks. So probably for them it would not be so difficult to adapt or to learn and all of that. But nonetheless, irrespective of whether you're young or senior or whatever, we are treading something totally unknown. Nobody knows where you're heading, right? So you have to explore, you have to discover, you have to learn. There's nothing like a ready map which is already there, right? Uh which you can navigate, or the typical linear kind of career ladders that we had earlier. It's not going to make sense. In fact, I doubt even if we'll have the same titles as technical writers or technical communicators, right? Now, people are talking about context engineers, content curators. There are as many titles, and this may uh vary as much as possible because. It depends upon the company, it depends upon the scale, it depends upon the size and so on. So if we try to typically expect things in the future based on the past, it's not going to work anymore. So the flexibility is one thing which is very, very important. But definitely one thing that one should definitely do and should have an excellent skill. And that's where I really appreciate your podcast. Like I said in my earlier conversation, the kind of questions that you ask, you know. That's a skill by itself. Because asking the right questions is going to really add a lot of value, and that's going to be a differentiator. Because now we take on roles as reviewers and editors, and we have to keep reviewing stuff endlessly through the entire day, right? And you have to ask a lot of questions. You'll have to call out what is trash, what is bullshit, what is right, what's wrong, what's not good, and all of that. And how are you going to do that, right? So you have to keep asking a lot of questions, challenge the status quo. You have to go back and tell them this is right, not right, and so on. So asking the right questions is one of the most like in the earlier days we used to say the interviewing skills where we used to connect with SME and ask a lot of questions. Unless you ask the right questions, you will not get the right content, right? So it's very important, I would say, going ahead. That's one skill. I would say thinking is critical. Asking questions is equally important to understand the why aspect because, like I said earlier, irrespective of all the automation, the explaining aspect, the fundamental aspect of what this product is, what the feature is all about, or all the conceptual related stuff is going to be done by writers, and you need to know to do that very well. Right.

Zohra: 23:57

And that it doesn't matter which way you are on your career journey, how your experience. But when I asked you this, yeah, when I asked you this question, Ramesh, I came with a very different expectation from you in terms of the answer. But the and it's actually good. You broke, I suppose, you challenged me in a way to think differently because here I am experienced, and I thought you might say, Oh yeah, the youngsters and probably speak about them, but you actually started with the the experienced professionals have to unlearn. And that was a very, I think, a good way for me to challenge myself. I didn't expect that. I didn't expect that answer. So that's so important. I didn't even think about it. That what the experienced have to do, because I thought, oh, maybe the experienced are more advantaged, but you actually challenge that with your response, which was uh that fixed thinking, no experimentation, generally as we grow in our careers, that tends to happen.

Ramesh: 25:00

Right, uh Zohra, because we also have to move from hyper uh specialization to a generalization right now, because we have to move with the flow, we have to be extremely flexible, we have to connect, we have to have discourses, we have to connect with stakeholders, a lot of aspects, you know. So we cannot go with a rigid mind because see ultimate differentiator is the mindset, right? So and it's so important that you have need to have the right attitude to be able to survive and thrive. It's like when you're seeking storms, we cannot say this is the way I will do it, right? I mean, you never know how the storm is coming, what's the speed, how to handle it, right? So you'll have to uh do what is best at that particular moment and see how you uh kind of you know react to the whole thing. And merely reaction will not help. You need to respond to it in the right way, and that is only possible when you have an open mind.

Zohra: 25:57

Yeah, and I think the earlier point that you made about self-reflecting is equally important because when you're in the storm in the thick of it, you're reacting, but then it's also important to pause and reflect is this where I'm headed? The what my response is, is that the right response? Because you still want to respond in an informed way. Would you agree with that?

Ramesh: 26:21

Absolutely. I give a lot of importance to, uh, self-introspection because I do a lot of mentoring and I see that uh people at times want to do things very, very mechanical. Uh, we are so used to the rat race, or we just want to compare ourselves with others and try to do things that have already been done. Uh, do only a few things because they are easy. Uh, we don't challenge us and say now you need to be prodded, you need to be nudged, and all of that. But if you really introspect, if you really understand yourself better, the way you would relate to the outside world will be far better, be it your professional life or other things. And when we say introspect, you really understand yourself. What is that? Because all said and done, we need to understand what is the purpose, how do we really create meaning in what we are doing, right? Because even the professional life, when you're spending a substantial amount of time of the day and the life, you definitely want it to be meaningful, satisfying, and fulfilling. It should not be like at the end of the day, you're so frustrated and you feel like, why am I doing this day in and day out? What's the point? You're not enjoying the process, and naturally, if some you're doing something that you're not enjoying, it doesn't give you joy, nor will it give others, right? So, and when will you realize that? You can realize that only when you introspect, when you pause, as you rightly said, stop, pause, and think, why am I doing this? What is the potential that I have? What am I good at? What would I like to do? No, the more you think, you will get some of these answers because, as we all know, all answers are within us only, right? And then it's just that we don't seek it, we don't spend time, we don't spend quality time with us because we are so busy hustling and doing things, you know. We don't get that time. So once you do that, and when you actually start putting things down and you get that clarity, the growth happens very fast. And uh the growth sometimes is so good that you yourself will not expect because there is nothing like can't, right? In that. Because that is something that you really understand very well. You know you want to do it, you love it. Then growth is like 10x times or maybe 100x times, but that exercise is extremely important because self-realization, as we say, is the goal, and the endeavors always to learn more about ourselves, which never really happens in the real world. It takes a lot of time to do that, and we are always figuring out what is the purpose, what is the meaning, and so on. So, of course, it may sound a bit spiritual or philosophical, but I would say in the age of AI world, it is very important that we need to uh kind of get back to the roots of the human thought process or action, and definitely all that is based on philosophy and all this kind of thinking, which will make you a better individual. Because if all that thinking didn't happen earlier, we wouldn't be here doing some of the things that we do today.

Zohra: 29:42

The episode is sponsored by LavaCon, the content strategy conference taking place this October in Charlotte, North Carolina. With more than 70 sessions and workshops featuring speakers from companies like Salesforce, TikTok, T-Mobile, and Amazon, LavaCon brings together content strategists, documentation leaders, and content professionals to share practical ideas you can apply right away. And yes, it's known as the Fun Conference, too, with networking events, therapy dogs, comfort llamas, storytelling, and karaoke. Use discount code ITC26 to save $200 on registration. Even though we are taking a bit of a philosophical and a spiritual approach to this discussion, that's exactly I think what I'm looking for. Because in this time of hustling and the rat race, as you mentioned, we've become so mechanical. We are responding on the go. And from a human perspective, it's not sustainable, right? Each day you cannot be treating it as a transaction. You've got to live it. And if you're going to live it, you need that self-realization. I would also add self-awareness to guide where you want to go. That answer only can come from within. So I'm not going to shy away from that conversation, uh Ramesh. I'm happy that you're bringing these things to the fore because we don't talk about them. We are on the go, go, go. And it's very important to pause and to reflect so that you can move forward in a better way. And with that, that this question comes to mind. You talked about the new titles that are emerging. In fact, my company also rolled out new titles for us. Personally, I feel awesome about it. And I do feel that from where I see there is a career evolution that is happening, and those titles are appropriate to what we are doing. Because titles do carry some weight. That said, what is your take? Seeing these new titles, is there a genuine career evolution happening? Because what I'm saying is anecdotal. What are you seeing in the field?

Ramesh: 31:43

I would not necessarily say it's an evolution. I would say getting back to some of the core uh skills that we have or foundational and kind of getting into depth with that, you know, because sometimes we are just so caught up in the technical skills or you know, uh, or tools and other things, we forget that we are communicators first. And irrespective of your knowledge, you know, uh communication is what really enriches it. And that's our job because we say we simplify the complex and what can do it better than communication. And it's just not about communicating again, right? Communication is also about enriching lives, right? Or elevating uh lives, in this case, particularly about your customers, right? Or users. And that's what our goal is, right? The goal of a documentation team is to exceed customer expectations. So are we really doing justice to that? Is what we really need to see. I mean, if we are writing some conceptual content to write from scratch, are we doing our best? Are we investing our time in such a way that we are telling the best stories? Or is there are there any alternatives? Can we do it better? Can we do it in a different way? How much of experimentation do we really do that? How much of that do we really share socially? Do we talk about those experiments? Do we share those experiments? Do we connect with people? Do we connect with customers? Do we really understand their behaviors? I doubt we do a lot of that, right? Because we don't have the time to do that, because we are so caught up in the mechanics that we don't spend time in some of these things which are critical to our goal itself. And that's always been a challenge all the time. We talk about understanding our audience, we talk about understanding our user needs, but sometimes the users themselves are so vague about everything, starting from requirements to using the product, to adopting the product, to being able to use the document and so on. And if you see the conversations they have with the bots and other things, when they visit the site, you'll realize there are so many errors and bugs, and there are so many issues that they are grappling with, which sometimes are so straightforward, or a lot of that can be prevented. I would say, why do so many issues happen in the first place? If you understand your audience and user needs so well, we take pride in saying that we reduce support tickets and adding to the bottom line or adding to the revenue. But why have those support tickets in the first place? That should be your value add. You have to we talk about innovation. What innovation are we really doing from that perspective? How well we understand the product or the behaviors that we can avoid such things. We have to take a preventive approach than a reactive approach to documents because it's all about the experience, as I said. It's all about the taste that I mentioned when I gave an analogy of that dish. Now that is something which is cultivated over a period of time. We really need to understand that well. A person who has cooked and tasted multiple times will only understand the subtle things of that. Only he will be able to distinguish which ingredient is more, why is the flavor such, or why is the aroma such. Only they will be in a better position, or only they will have that discernment and judgment to do those things. That is where we should be focusing on the subtle aspects, not the gross or the raw stuff. You know, I would say that is where the value add will happen. I hope again, like I said, I tend to go on. I don't know whether this one was an interesting answer.

Zohra: 35:42

But I want to again go back to you said that the career really isn't evolving. Because in my question, I asked you the career evolution that's happening with the titles. And again, I came here with a certain expectation, and you challenged me in a good way, where you said that it's the core skills that are kind of reflected with the new titles. We are going back to what the different aspects of our profession that are now surfacing, the specialization even within what we do as a technical writer. And you prompted me to think that maybe technical writing became a title that was looked down upon lately was because it it sounded very mechanical. It sounded very monotonous. And all the other attributes of the profession are now AI is probably giving us a chance to dig into those and really specialize content engineering, content strategy. Just think about it in a creative way. Again, as a communicator, how can you get creative with those aspects of your profession? Thank you for that.

Ramesh: 36:48

Absolutely, because I think something that doesn't go away from uh writing is writing is primary thinking, and writing is all about articulation. Writing is about research, writing is about creativity, writing is about structure. What we talk about information architecture, design, and all that. But AI can vomit a lot of content, but if it cannot tell you what is the right structure, and that comes inherently with good writing skills, right? Because writing is all about the structure, the flow, the context, the examples, the visuals, and so on. So these are some very inherent and core skills, I would say. I mean, of course, you can specialize in this, but if we were to say what is good tech writing, it's all of this. Like I said, it's multiple skills, right? So we have to excel in these to be able to add value, or that is what is good tech writing all about, is what I would say. And that is where we need to get to. And I think AI is giving us an opportunity to do that because we need to be more of thinkers right now and see how we can really handle this and do better in such a situation. So, I mean, I in a way I would say AI is doing uh good stuff to us because it's taking us back to the core skills, making us think, get to the depth of things, you know, look at the product or software or technology in different ways, try to seek user needs in a different way, provide better experiences. Because unlike the earlier days, uh things have radically changed, even for the software engineers. And for them, at least they have the QAs who can test their code. But for documentation, we don't have anybody who will test that. It is the writer who has to do it, right? He has to take ownership for that.

Zohra: 38:40

Yeah, and it's a beautiful irony that AI is allowing us to really dig deep, actually. And this was again when I switched and I started pivoting and experimenting with AI, I did not expect that outcome. And where I am today, those for me again, this is personally, has definitely been the experience. And you kind of are validating that anecdotal experience of mine. Uh Ramesh, you you mentioned you have this global experience with through the mentoring and the work that you've done. Does globalization create greater opportunity for us technical communicators, or does it also risk making documentation work something organizations increasingly evaluate primarily through cost?

Ramesh: 39:29

I think it increases opportunity. Definitely there's a cost aspect. I mean, hiring or investment in people has always had the cost aspect. But again, getting the right talent is equally important. As a good leader, you would always ensure that you get the right talent to avoid a lot of other things which may cost you in a different way. So, in that sense, if you have to get the right hire, you cannot restrict yourself to certain regions or certain areas or whatever. So, in that sense, globalization definitely makes a lot of sense because you get access to good talent pool, and as far as your business needs are concerned, they will be met, and definitely it will create more opportunities. And of course, uh it's not going to be similar across regions or whatever. It's all dictated by the needs and the talent and the skills and the requirements and so on. So, but if you ask me, I would definitely recommend globalization as far as our profession. One, of course, in terms of opportunities, uh, but in terms of learning, or I work a lot with communities, and for me, in this age, all the learning will happen only socially, not traditional ways. So I would rate that you need to be part of a global network or global communities to be able to learn more. You need to experiment more, share more, invite views, learn from others, and so on. So, in that particular context, yes, globalization makes a lot of sense. In fact, I would say even three, four decades back, a lot of my learning uh did happen through my peers who are based across the globe. I mean, because even the cultural uh nuances are equally important because each uh peer brings a different aspect. And as we go ahead, I would say that even linguistics, cultural nuances are very important from an end-user perspective. The more you understand that, the value that you will add will be far better. And in that case, definitely understanding globalization, global cultures, different regions, different individuals is more important, is what I would say.

Zohra: 41:49

Yeah, in that same way, Ramesh, where do you see career expectations differing between one country? I don't want to say India versus the US, but just across the world. How do you see career expectations differing?

Ramesh: 42:05

I I think more than career, I would say access to resources, be it in terms of learning, be in terms of knowledge, or other things which enable learning and thereby the career, right? And I would give a quick example. Like I will give my own example. Uh when I started off uh tech writing, I was clueless about tech writing, right? I had started with ISO documentation. Now, if if I were to learn tech writing, I would always recommend that you learn tech writing from the right tech writer. That's very important because unless you learn tech writing the right way, it's not going to make a huge difference, right? Because if I learn the wrong stuff, I'll be doing uh totally unaware the things which I should not be doing. Now, you need a right person to be able to guide you. All right, and in that case, I would say I was extremely fortunate to have peers who are very seasoned tech writers back then itself who guided me uh through this process. And that is where mentoring plays a very important role. It's just not about skills, but there is somebody overseeing you, guiding you on that path, helping you deal with every challenge. Not that they are practically doing it, but they are there to kind of you know enable your growth, right? And that's is very important, is what I would say. And uh mentoring is more than the theoretical stuff that we talk about. Mentoring is never about theoretical stuff, or it is not coaching, or it is not spoon feeding, it's about you do your own stuff, but if there is some major eventuality or something, something very serious, some something seriously going wrong, either with what you're doing, your career or something, there is somebody to help you to avoid those pitfalls or somebody to correct that, somebody to bring you on the right path with your experience, with your knowledge, with your examples. And that is where I think we are lacking right now somewhere, because one, of course, uh, we are seeking new horizons. There's there is no clarity, and definitely there are going to be no clear-cut roles, clear-cut demarcation, and all of that. But at the same time, culturally, not everybody is willing to share, mentor, and all of that. Like, unlike what I've seen in the past, people were so forthcoming and they were so willing because it requires a lot of energy and time to help somebody grow, right? I mean, while you have your own professional and personal commitments, imagine that you are investing in mentoring others, right? And I really appreciate all those who have done that for me and who have been doing that as part of various communities in the last few decades, you know. And I think that trend should continue. But unfortunately, with a lot of devices, with a lot of technology advancement, and now with AI, slowly that people connect is missing. I mean, the communities are slowly dying down. People are not building, they are not nurturing that. And I and the irony is now all the learning has to happen socially. It's all about experiments. Now, if I do an experiment and if I don't connect with others, or if I don't know whom I should talk to, how am I going to learn? That's where I think the social aspect or the community aspect plays a very critical role. And I think we as a profession need to do a lot to nurture these communities, right? And unfortunately, there are not many global communities right now or communities of repute that are there or exist. There could be a lot of communities in pockets doing great work, but I think the synergy aspect would be missing, right? And that's what is really required the unifying aspect or bringing in all that knowledge, bringing in all the insights, you know. And that's going to be one of the most important things as we go forward.

Zohra: 46:24

You're making me ask a lot of questions, but I'm going to go with this one question. You rightly mentioned that you have to have the right mentoring. Now, somebody who is getting mentored, what do you think they should be looking for? What kind of red flag should they be looking for? If they are getting mentored, if they're fortunate, but things that they should not be learning, or rather unlearning, or even maybe teaching the mentor. I would love to get a take on that.

Ramesh: 46:51

Like I said, you know, first thing is, of course, even before you take any mentoring, I think that self-introspection is very important. Unless you have that, even a mentor will not be able to help you. So at least you should have a clear idea. Or if you don't have one, of course you can see because innate qualities, inherent strengths differ from individual to individual. It's like a mentor will not have a universal solution for everyone. It's like you have to really go into depth for each individual. It's all about customization, personalization, it's all about your aspirations, it's about your dreams and wishes. And of course, the gap between it, like I might aspire for a lot of things, but if my strengths are not aligned with that, I may not be able to achieve that. So it's it requires a lot of courage also to tell you the truth up front, like what you have, what you don't have, what you can do well, like typically the writer and the editor, right? If the editor shies away from telling you that you know the content is great or not, or whatever, then you're really not doing a service uh to the writer in that sense. Because you're not really helping that person, because trying to please somebody is not going to really help you, or giving temporary solutions is not going to work for the individual. Advice as important as "You should not be working in this field" is equally important if they don't have the skills, right? But I think very few people uh would speak up like that or would be upfront. But I think that's important because you really need to work at that level with a mentee to be able to really understand all aspects holistically, even before you suggest anything. And the mentoring happens much later, I would say, only when you understand all of this. It's not like you directly dive in, like somebody says, I want to learn this, and you start mentoring. I never do that, in fact. I never coach, also, I never train people. I just try to be in the background and try to enable their growth with what is available and whatnot. So that's the approach I would take from a mentoring perspective. And it's been pretty successful at that. And of course, I have also told a lot of people why they should not take up tech writing also as a profession. So, but I think truth and honesty is equally important no matter what profession you are, or what professional, the most important aspect of that is professional ethics, and you also owe it to the profession. You also owe it to the professions, right? So you have to do the right things all the time. You should not hesitate or restrain yourself from doing that. So be it mentoring or be it creating deliverables or serving the customers. Um it's all the same. I think it's all about servant leadership. You've consciously made a choice to serve or give back or do things that you wish to, right? That's the way I look at it, including mentoring. So the point is to enable and empower the individual. You can only do that when you understand the individual better. And if you don't, you need to enable them to do that, and as a result of the outcome, enable them with whatever is required. And that requires the individual themselves to do a lot of effort. It could be very difficult, it could be complex, it may take time, it may not yield results as you expect. But nonetheless, it will happen because once you're set up on the right path, you're set up for success. It's the path that is important because without that foresight, you know, it will not help. You may have the best uh vehicle, but if you don't have a map, you may not land at your destination. You have to have the map, you have to have the GPS to be able to reach your destination. But who gives the GPS? Mentoring could be that.

Zohra: 50:53

It's been a great discussion, Ramesh. I invite you. Do you have any last thoughts that you would like to add?

Ramesh: 50:59

I would say that we often say that our work should speak, but I disagree on that. I feel as technical communicators, we should speak about our work. We should be very vocal advocates and we should be ambassadors of our profession. My mission is to create awareness and promote our profession. And I would request, I mean, through this podcast, I would like to say unless we invest our time in being vocal or being an advocate for our own profession, we'll not be able to survive and thrive. So it's very important to nurture our own profession. It's very important to connect with fellow communicators. It is very important to be part of a community. It's important to give back. It's not just being consuming, it's not about just taking or it's also about giving, giving back whatever you can. So it's good to be part of a community and give back apart from your professional commitments. And I think that will really keep uh the profession really thriving. And I don't think so. Any technology can really replace or take away tech comm because tech comm or communication by itself can only enrich and elevate the way we go ahead. That's my message to all.

Zohra: 52:26

Thank you, Ramesh. And I want to give a big shout out to Nibu for introducing us. Without that introduction, we wouldn't have had this conversation. So thank you, Ramesh.

Ramesh: 52:36

And definitely, I would also like to thank Nibu for introducing me to you. And I enjoyed every bit of this conversation. Thanks to Nibu. And it was great talking to you, Zohra, today. And uh I hope it was useful and uh helpful. If not, definitely I can look forward to sharing more stuff if required.

Zohra: 52:58

This was very helpful, and I would love to have you again on my show in the next season. So, with that, thanks, Ramesh. Have a great evening. I know you're calling from India. It's pretty late in the evening for you there. I appreciate your time and have a good one.

Ramesh: 53:11

Thank you, Zohra. You do have a great day. Thanks for talking to me today, and all the best, and you're doing a great job uh through these podcasts. I only hope and wish you all the best that you continue and invite as many experts, and this is the best way to give back to the community, too.

Zohra: 53:28

Thank you. Thank you for listening to Inside Tech Comm. If there's a guest you would love to hear on the show, please let me know. And don't forget to follow and catch every episode on your favorite podcast app. See you next time.